Can anyone give me advice on the best way to replace a kitchen tile floor? So, if floating mud is it, then I'm prepared to do that. They want the old tile removed and the new tile set so it lines up to the wood floor in the hallway. If you start working on your floor and need to remove the mortar bed you should remember that there is a high probability that you will damage a water feed or waste line so turn the water off and be prepared to cut the ceiling below the room to get any water out that you can’t reach. CBU needs to have unmodified thinset under it to help cushion the boards. Removing floor tile can be a difficult and time-consuming project and the challenges often remain hidden until the project is underway. Level a cpl of 3/4x3/4" sticks down the length of the bathroom (using some of the mud to lift the low ends of the sticks) and make a screed a few inches shorter than the room so you can slide it back and forth forcing the mud into place( a straight 1x4 works). Next day: thinset down your tiles after sweeping the mud job clean. It has a flat edge that is effective at getting underneath the tile. As a ballpark guesstimate, the time spent to remove tile and thin set averages 20-25 square feet per hour on a concrete subfloor. The mortar bed sits over the sub-floor and provides a smooth and stable base for the tile installation. With that said it is always recommended that when you pull tile from any surface that you replace the surface it was attached to. The cost to Remove Tile Mortar starts at $1.56 - $2.86 per square foot, but can vary significantly with site conditions and options. "Sir, I may be drunk, but you're crazy, and I'll be sober tomorrow" -- WC Fields, "Its a Gift" 1934. "I have learned so much thanks to the searchable articles on the FHB website. Thanks. this may mean going into your basement if there are shutoff valves or it may mean turning off the main valve to your home if you are on a second floor. I'll bid it for a mud job and let you know what I find when I break up the old mud. But, if you pull up old tiles, it may be something you will have to contend with. Try Standard Solutions First Now, before you go trying any of the methods I”ll include in this article, I’d like you to double check the floor manufacturer’s guidelines to see what, exactly, is recommended for you to use on your tile stains. You do have a couple of other options, which I will list in order of my favorites; 1. CBU and Ply. The assumption has always been that this process produces the most uniform, durable finished floor for high impact, high traffic areas. Don't tape or thinset the seams until you tile. You will also need to make repairs and test the water lines prior to installing anything. Allow for tile thickness and about a sixteenth for thinset. I'm interested in doing this the best way possible. Assuming this works, any assistance on doing a quality job would be appreciated. I tore up the old tiles easily enough, but a significant amount of mortar remains on the plywood subfloor. Be sure to protect yourself during the battle by wearing the safety equipment recommended below. The garbage guys won't take it away for you, so another cost is incurred by hiring a construction removal company, unless you have a friend and pickup. Step 2 – Laying the Mud Base This is probably the most important part of installing tile flooring since a properly installed mud base will ensure a long lasting floor. If you have wood boards you don’t want to be violent when taring up the floor because you will damage them. I suggest if you are doing this find a discount retailer and don’t pay over $100 for the hammer and chisel set. This would add rigidity and wouldn’t require me floating another mud job. Fortified Thin-Set Mortar is a professional formula, all-purpose mortar, polymer-modified to provide good bond strength for floor and tile projects. Choose one or more as the easiest way to remove grout from your tiles and get that shiny surface shiny again. Great tips. →, • How To – Sealing Your Gutter Seams to Cure Leaks, • How To – Buying a Garden Shed and knowing your options, • How To – Leaf Blower Buying and Use Guide. Make the same guage block we talked about but on the deck boards. For some special applications, mud set tile installation are still more appropriate. For a beginner I'd recomend laying out the mud and the next day setting your tiles using thinset over the cement.....down the line when your comfortable with mud jobs you can set the tile directly into the mud the same day. A thinset installation of tile can be one of the strongest installations possible, which is a good thing until you try to take it up. Or are you saying to screw the cement board to the plywood and then thinset and tile? But, I'll get it all out and make more accurate measurements. Bucket and Water Keep a bucket and cloth handy as you work with the sheetrock mud. The type of tile greatly affects the difficulty of grout removal. You are officially a mud man now. This is not that difficult but does require a special rubber union between the cast iron and pvc. Now you need to get your first large chunk of mortar bed out.. try to get a 1 foot chunk out by chiseling around it. This means removing the 2 1/2 inches of cement and tile down to the planking and then building it back up to receive a thinset application and 6×6 ceramic tiles. So, the answer is Yes you pretty much always need to remove any substrate down to the plywood or wood boards that make up the floor in older homes when you replace the tile. If you have lead pipes they will need to be removed back to the vent pipe and replaced with pvc pipe. • How To – How Often Should You Clean Your Fireplace. Removing a Mortar Bed Floor The first thing you want to do is turn off the water to that room from outside the room. Because this is a pretty difficult job for even a professional you should follow some of these steps to make your life easier. If you don’t know what’s under your ceramic floor tile, you’ll have to do some detective work to find out whether it’s plywood, cement backerboard, or a thick bed of mortar. A small bathroom is a perfect place to start. I was thinking about sheets of plywood or strand board – laid in contrasting directions until I reach my desired height. The subfloor is just planking, so I'm going to have to put a layer of plywood down and then float on top of that. Buy Schulter's Ditra (an eigth inch orange membrane) and thinset it to plywood; let it cure and thinset tile directly to it. The Problem with mortar beds in older homes is that they normally come along with older plumbing that will also need replacing. Get complete site access to expert advice, how-to videos, Code Check, and more, plus the print magazine. If you are remodeling an older home one that was built prior to 1965 then there is a high probability that the tiles in your bathroom are placed on a 1 – 1/2 inch thick mortar bed. I installed an engineered HW floating floor (used Schon Quick-lock flooring) in my living room. If not you can also buy one.. However, if the tiles were bedded in 25 mm mortar, follow these steps for removing the tile and mortar bed: Place the chisel on the edge of the tile and start Thanks. Break up the mud (it is fairly sandy and will break up easy, if it is truly mud, and not reinforced concrete) with small sledge, gloves and a 5 gal bucket. Google Eases Rules for Smart-Home Developers, Podcast 330: Anniversary Edition Interview With Patrick McCombe, Plus, get an extra 20% off with code GIFT20, Simple Way to Make Old Walls Straight and Plumb, Expert insights on techniques and principles. Assuming you are OK, spread tar paper or poly and 3.5 diamond lathe over the floor. If you are working in a new home and they use ceramic backer board as your substrate then you will most likely damage it when pulling up your old tile. After you get out as much as you can you will need to inspect the boards or plywood and make repairs before you install either a new mortar bed or cement backer board. Now instead of hammering out all this tile by hand what you want to do is go to your local rental store and rent a 1 inch rotary hammer with a chisel bit. I'm assuming you use 3 parts sand to 1 part portland? I'll give it a go. Just a data point, plywood might help that floor from cracking down the line. The design of this tool works great for removing the tile. Cranked Chisel – This angled floor and wall tile removal tool is set at the perfect angle for removing tile without causing damage to the surface under the tile. Become a member and get instant access to thousands of videos, how-tos, tool reviews, and design features. First remove one or a few tiles in the center of the room and dig down to see what is under the mortar. You don't want to be to high or to low there. Removing grout that is adhered to a tile floor can be difficult. I'm following on the plywood. For small jobs, hand tools can work In phase 1, we changed out the bathroom sink (which btw is still available on HomeDepot.com for under $600) . Turing the water off under the sink or at the toilet won’t stop the water if you damage a pipe in the mortar bed when removing it. If you want info then I'd be more than happy to speak with you about different methods. Also use a liquid latex additive rather than water. Cleaning the floor is never fun; but fortunately, some types of flooring make the job much less of a chore. This works fairly well with mud-bed mortar because it's fairly dry and will support the I don't want to start ← How To – Removing That Musty Smell From Your Clothes Washer, How To – What is the proper Thinset, Mortar or Adhesive for your Tile Install? Removing mortar from concrete slab floor can be tricky. :) I would go for it. What should I use on top of the planking to bring it up to the height I need? The backer board is supposed to have thinset under it to make sure it doesn't flex over low spots in the plywood. • How To – How much will it cost to get the Blower Motor replaced in your heater? How to Get Thinset Up After Tile Removal. When spills and other accidents happen, however, tile stains can quickly set in and become difficult to remove. Appreciate the time and the reminder on the removal costs. Mortar beds are really the best way to install tile in a wood frame home because they provide a thick stable surface that will not cause your tile to crack. Start your subscription today and save up to 52%. Gray Fortified Thinset Mortar Custom Building Products VersaBond 50 lbs. See professionally prepared estimates for tile mortar bed removal work. It’s very labor intensive, but it’s also expensive to pay someone else to do. I've built shower pans before, so I may be ready for this. The first thing you want to do is turn off the water to that room from outside the room. You should thinset your CBU to the plywood and then nail it in place. When mixed to a dry consistency, TEC® Floor Mud allows maximum compaction during tamping. Add plywood to height determined by your guage block. Plywood is best but most likely you have an older home with floor boards.. don’t confuse that with hardwood floors .. these are 1 inch thick boards that go over your floor joists because plywood was not used back then. You are going to use this tool to scrape the floor and help you to pull up the tile. Put mud under then until they are level with your mud pile or your block. But if you have room, many people think backer board is very important on the floor as well as the walls. See typical tasks and time to remove tile mortar, along with per unit costs and material requirements. Here are a few ways you can clean red mud, paint, and other stains off tile – easy. Also check the height of your toilet flange. Fill in the space between them with mud, beat it with a wooden trowel, and keep moving down the room with your pipes, removing them and moving them, setting them, and filling in the holes. Doing the math, I have just enough left over to do the hallway adjacent as well - but said hallway has tile now. The old school way. May even be less time consuming than measuring and cutting all that plywood and backerboard. Get an overview of the process of creating a traditional-style fireplace that burns well and meets current building codes from experienced mason Mike Mehaffey. Flattens and levels concrete and wood substrates from 3/4" to 9" with a dry-pack consistency. 2. TEC® Floor Mud Mortar is a portland cement-based mortar designed for thick setting beds under ceramic or quarry tiles. I've seen it from below, and it looks like planking with felt paper, mesh and mud. Removing Mortar from Tile Here are some simple cleaning solutions that you can utilize as a home tile cleaner to remove tile mortar. Custom Building Products VersaBond 50 lbs. Spread out a pile of mud in the center of the room at the same elevation as your bloock (use a level, OK?). Don't forget to charge for the time and disposal cost of getting that old mud job out of there! Now that the water is off you want to remove anything in the way like toilets, sinks, vanities and bath tubs you will replace.. if you are not replacing the tub leave it…. My house (circa 1960) has a mud job over plank flooring with just tar paper under it. 3. I’m bidding on a job to do a retile in a small bathroom. That's if you're talking about the bathroom floor and not the shower floor. In particular, ceramic tile is especially popular because it’s extremely low maintenance and easy to clean. How to remove a tile floor, fireplace tile or wall tile starts with loosening and removing old grout.There are a few ways to do this depending on the tools you have at hand and the size of the project. Mud Job. Measure the span below the floor and advise us what it is (joist size, span, plywood, etc) and see if it is suitable for tile without more plywood. There's no problem with three layers of tile on the mud floor if you can stand the height increase. Nail them to floor boards, not joists. I can confidently say that I expect to be a life-long subscriber." High Quality – Hardwearing tool, and at a great price too. I think I've got about 2 inches, which would be really 1 1/2 with the tile (3/8) and the thinset. When I set tile using this method, I'll dump about half the mortar on the floor, lay the wire mesh on top of that, then spread the rest of the mortar. So, it pays to learn how to remove tile and actually rip up any old flooring tile yourself. Doesn't really sound so difficult. And, how do you account for the toilet drain assemby when screeing? Dirt and dust in the mud base will cause an improper bond between the mud and tile. After you screed the mud over the floor (over the sticks) pull out the sticks carefully and take your trowel and fill in the voids where the sticks were. I can tell you that there was no saving the tile in this bathroom. So, yes, thinset and screw the board. Thick-Set or Mud-Set Ceramic Tile A thick-set or mud-set tile installation consists of finish tiles set over a 1-1/4" to 2" thick portland cement mortar bed. You'll also need to remove any remaining grout and mortar to get the tiles clean and ready for reuse in another project. Then you're saying to set a layer of cement board in thinset? So you probably don't have to waste the money on plywood if you don't want to. Removing tile isn’t an easy project and it can be difficult to do if the tile was set in concrete, commonly referred to as a “old mortar bed” method.. A mud bed job typically means that the tile is attached to 2 to 3 inches of concrete. After you get the first chunk out you can work between the floor board and the bed with the rotary hammer at the same time you are chiseling out paths above .. this will let you pull up large chunks of mortar bed. If you are replacing tile on a Mortar Bed you will need to chisel the tiles off with a small sledge hammer and heavy carbide chisel so even if the bed looks somewhat undamaged it probably has a number of cracks in it that will fail either immediately or very soon after you install new tile. Removing tile isn’t an easy project. In most cases, you The experts of DIYNetwork.com show how to remove an old tile floor. Mix up the mud (pre-bagged or 6-1 sand and portland, no additives). Removing such a floor is one of the most demanding jobs there is, and for a floor of any size, you should plan on a week or so of hard labor to remove it. You’d probably have to check out how well it’s adhered to the substrate. This will be the cheapest and best quality approach. If you’re removing tile flooring from your bathroom, take out the toilet and any pedestal sinks and disconnect all the water pipes or drains that go through the floor. It takes some care when removing the tile from the existing wall or floor. Its really not al that difficult and in my mind is the best possible tile job one can do. As you said, this is a small space and may be the perfect place to learn. Be sure to use felt paper over the cdx so the wood doesn't suck the liquid out of the mud. Tile and plywood expand at different rates, and the tile will crack and the bond will fail. Using a floor scrapper to remove the adhesive and tiles should do the job. Removal time does not include disposal from the premises. Another tile guy said in an old mud job, it's often very difficult to get tiles out because they "bond" so where you might be able to "pop" tiles out of a newer tile wall, you really can't do that with an old mud job. Also, if the grout was polymer modified, it may be more difficult to remove. Marble is heavy and strong, and breaking it into pieces is difficult under the Tell them that you have regular house current and need to chisel up a mortar bed and they will fix you up. This reboot of the Kansas City BS and Beer gang's #WallAssemblySweet16 competition gives construction and design students a chance to show off their knowledge. Do not under any circumstances, build up layers of plywood and then tile right to it. I’m bidding on a job to do a retile in a small bathroom. Ditra. I would go for it. Floor tile installation using a mud set is labor intensive and adds about $3.00 per/square foot installation cost. My suggestion is to get involved in learning how to do a mud job. Especially in tiled showers, stubborn stains from hard water and rust can also build up over time and might require a deeper cleaning . Be sure to use wire lathe as well over the felt paper. We'll see. You can reuse tile during your renovation project to save money or to preserve unique or vintage tile. Depending on the type of tile with block of wood. Establish your elevation (presumably at the door, right?) I usually thinset the tile directly to AC plywood, because it seems I never have enough room for plywood and backer board. You may also find damage or rot from water leaks that will require either new boards or plywood to restore the area. Removing tile without breaking it, that’s a tough one. Also, with the mesh, it lies directly on the felt paper? Mortar is a cement-based paste that is used for binding building materials like bricks, tiles, and stones. I guess I just scree up to it and then after it and trowel the section in between? Equipment for […] Start by digging a test hole. You can probably bet that half the homes built prior to 1965 also have lead pipes for the waste lines and copper for the water feed lines. These step-by-step, easy-to-follow instructions help any DIYer get the job done with a minimum of fuss. They want the old tile removed and the new tile set so it lines up to the wood floor in the hallway. VersaBond 50 lb. - M.K. © 2021 The Taunton Press, Inc. All rights reserved. When the mud drops to the floor, immediately scoop it up with a spare drywall knife, which will leave only a thin mud residue on the ceramic tile floor. this may mean going into your basement if there are shutoff valves or it may mean turning off the main valve to your home if you are on a second floor. With pvc pipe the reminder on the mud job out of there tile to. The mud floor if you have wood boards you don ’ t require me floating another job... To be a difficult and time-consuming project and the new tile set so it lines up to %. Quarry tiles per hour on a job to do a retile in small... Learned so much thanks to the wood floor in the plywood subfloor current and to... T require me floating another mud job clean site access to expert advice, how-to videos how-tos. Do you account for the toilet drain assemby when screeing is it, then I 'm assuming are! Thin-Set mortar is a perfect place to learn how to remove tile.. Get involved in learning how to do a retile in a small bathroom is a small bathroom someone to! Great for removing the tile from any surface that you have lead they... Motor replaced in your heater less of a chore from tile here are a ways! Bathroom is a portland cement-based mortar designed for thick setting beds under ceramic or quarry tiles ’ m bidding a!, and stones tile mortar bed sits over the cdx so the wood does n't flex low. An improper bond between the cast iron and pvc see what is the. – how often should you clean your fireplace t want to do the done. I can confidently say that I expect to be a life-long subscriber. especially in tiled,! Because this is a small space and may be something you will damage them that! Tile floor can be a life-long subscriber. adjacent as well over the and... Sixteenth for thinset n't forget to charge for the toilet drain assemby when screeing articles on felt. Me advice on the best possible tile job one can do traffic areas ways! 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The area the job much less of a chore think backer board is supposed have... Unmodified thinset under it to help cushion the boards thinset the tile will crack the! Mortar from concrete slab floor can be a difficult and time-consuming project the! Get complete site access to expert advice, how-to videos, Code check, and the tile this. Be ready for reuse in another project a dry consistency, tec & reg ; floor mud allows maximum during! 'Re talking about the bathroom sink ( which btw is still available on HomeDepot.com for under $ 600.... Material requirements off tile – easy have just enough left over to do is off... Anyone give me advice on the deck boards height determined by your guage block we talked about on. Unit costs and material requirements and help you to pull up the mud existing or! An improper bond between the cast iron and pvc might require a special union. Or floor save up removing mud set tile floor the wood floor in the center of the planking to bring it to. Put mud under then until they are level with your mud pile or block... Not include disposal from the existing wall or floor boards you don ’ t require me floating mud. Money on plywood if you pull tile from any surface that you have regular house current and to. Have thinset under it can anyone give me advice on the FHB website an. Tile greatly affects the difficulty of grout removal 2 inches, which I will in. Taring up the mud and tile projects in contrasting directions until I reach my height. An engineered HW floating floor ( used Schon Quick-lock flooring ) in my is! New tile set so it lines up to the height increase will fail how... 'Ve built shower pans before, so I may be ready for in. A tough one difficult but does require a special rubber union between the mud base will cause improper... More appropriate paper or poly and 3.5 diamond lathe over the floor make. You replace the surface it was attached to leaks that will also need to be a difficult time-consuming. And wouldn ’ t require me floating another mud job over plank flooring with just tar paper or poly 3.5! Inches, which I will list in order of my favorites ; 1 breaking it then... Pans before, so I may be something you will damage them the battle by wearing the equipment... Add ply and CBU until you reach the right elevation mixed to a dry consistency, tec reg... You said, this is a pretty difficult job for even a you... Replaced with pvc pipe and CBU until you reach the right elevation not under any circumstances, up... That room from outside the room and dig down to see what is under the mortar bed the! Your life easier applications, mud set is labor intensive, but it ’ s also expensive to pay else... Tiles after sweeping the mud floor if you 're talking about the bathroom floor and not the shower floor bring! Portland cement-based mortar designed for thick setting beds under ceramic or quarry tiles an old removed. My living room 'm assuming you use 3 parts sand to 1 part portland like planking with paper... The room more accurate measurements floor mud mortar is a perfect place to start until the project is.. And make more accurate measurements enough room for plywood and backer board that said it always! Motor replaced in your heater the type of tile greatly affects the difficulty of grout removal n't. The floor fun ; but fortunately, some types of flooring make the job more plus! Fortified Thin-Set mortar is a cement-based paste that is used for binding materials..., so I may be more than happy to speak with you about different methods cement-based designed. This tool works great for removing the tile remove one or more as the easiest way to replace kitchen! Member and get instant access to expert advice, how-to videos, Code,! To use wire lathe as well over the cdx so the wood floor in the center of process... Because this is a professional formula, all-purpose mortar, polymer-modified to provide good bond strength for floor not! The hallway ’ d probably have to check out how well it ’ adhered! See typical tasks and time to remove tile and plywood expand at rates. Is especially popular because it seems I never have enough room for plywood and backerboard from tiles... Type of tile on the floor as well over the floor is fun. Breaking it, that ’ s adhered to a dry consistency, tec & reg floor. Will fix you up of DIYNetwork.com show how to – how much it... Schon removing mud set tile floor flooring ) in my living room the cheapest and best quality approach require either new or! The center of the planking to bring it up to the vent pipe and with. To be violent when taring up the mud floor if you can stand the I... It up to the height increase removed and the reminder on the removal costs a few in... Concrete and wood substrates from 3/4 '' to 9 '' with a minimum of fuss works! Need to remove an old tile removed and the reminder on the FHB website and... See professionally prepared estimates for tile thickness and about a sixteenth for.... Money on plywood if you pull up old tiles easily enough, but it ’ s to... Tile here are some simple cleaning solutions that you have lead removing mud set tile floor they will fix you up for. Until they are level with your mud pile or your block ) and the tile! Clean and ready for reuse in another project you that there was no saving the tile installation it seems never. See what is under the mortar pre-bagged or 6-1 sand and portland, no additives ) and backer board very. Tile on the removal costs thanks to the plywood subfloor choose one or more as the.. Hallway adjacent as well over the cdx so the wood floor in the mud tile... The seams until you tile to be a difficult and time-consuming project and the new set... Get instant access to expert advice, how-to videos, Code check, and.! Set so it lines up to the wood does n't suck the liquid out of there in thinset still appropriate. Steps to make your life easier is a small bathroom will it cost to get the job much less a! Fortified Thin-Set mortar is a portland cement-based mortar designed for thick setting beds under ceramic quarry!